Joe Rogan and Diana Walsh Pasulka

Was anyone struck by the discussion about the pineal gland, where Joe discussed DMT? It reminded me of this excerpt from John G. Niehardt’s “Black Elk Speaks,” discussing Crazy Horse’s vision quest to discover his name. It’s almost as if the experience DMT users report is similar. Could there be entities that exist in that space, and are UAPs some kind of “projection” of their world into ours?